- cross-posted to:
- science@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- science@lemmy.ml
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We’ve been saying this for year yet people still refuse
My God, just reduce your meat intake and stop being a wuss. This thread is insufferable.
Business as usual. Climate crisis is everyone’s problem but me ! Everyone must make an effort, but not me !
It’s the triangle of inaction. Corporations, government and people blame the two others and use it as an excuse for inaction.
I can understand it in some cases, but meat consumption ? There is no excuse to not stop or at least reduce meat consumption. It’s easy to do, it’s cheaper, … And the impact of everyone not buying meat is insanely positive.
Meat is for me one of the easiest source of protein, and people in general consume already less protein than recommended. :( Many vegan option and/ or protein supplements are expensive. Vegetarian options are okay (eggs, for example) but going 100 percent vegan is difficult.
People aren’t going to care enough unless its significantly cheaper than meat and equally as much effort for the consumer but a lot of vegan alternatives to meat aren’t. It should be cheaper for all of the same reasons that it’s more environmentally friendly. Plus why full vegan? It’s more likely that people will move in small steps vegetarianism is still an option. We lose so much with the all or nothing approach.
Yeah thats a problem I have. I like some plant based meat/dairy alternatives but can’t justify paying so much. Meat and dairy should be quite a bit more expensive compared to plant based.
A vegan (or low-meat diet, for that matter) does not equate to substituting meat to processed meat alternatives. Other recipes that do without any fake meat exist.
Yeah obviously but vegan meat and dairy substitutes are a good option for many people looking to replace animal products
So would cracking down on the unnecessary private flights billionaires take.
The impact of eating meat is way bigger than the few private flights you are talking about, though those obviously shouldnt exist as well.
It’s true that for an average Brit, eating beef 3x a week is worse for the environment in a year than their annual holiday to Greece.
But billionaires aren’t just taking “a few private flights” they’re taking flights more often than I eat meat in the first place.
I’ve cut down on meat and my water and electricity usage, I haven’t been on a plane in 10 years. I use the car about once a month. I recycle, reuse, repurpose, I very very rarely buy new things. I’m chronically ill and living in fuel poverty. I’m anaemic ffs. How much more are the poor expected to do when then rich do nothing?
There are many problems in the world. Some people like to focus on the ones with the largest impacts, where you can personally do something about it (like veganism). Others like to focus on those where few cause grossly disproportionate harm, as they seem more addressable (like private jets).
Debating the merits of focusing on one problem over another is interesting, but in my mind the time for it is not when media is being shared that bolsters a cause without coming at the expense of any others. It hurts all movements when people always undermine issues, pointing to another more important from their perspective.
I highly doubt that most people think you aren’t doing enough for the environment. And I don’t understand why you’d assume that as the implication of this article.
I see this a lot. Someone asserts a truth (eating less meat is good for the environment), some prick pivots to assert that there are other things society can do (the rich take too many trips in private planes!) And every time it happens, it comes from someone who doesn’t like the first assertion and is trying to point at another problem they feel makes their behavior look less stupid and selfish.
It reminds me of a child caught misbehaving, who points at another child and snitches on them, hoping to distract their way out of trouble. “You can’t be mad at me for stealing a cookie because Jimmy stole three!”
An enlightened person would make the changes they can control, instead of pointing at ones they can’t as if it absolves them. Hell, even just admitting they don’t want to is less dishonest.
It’s true that there are many things that society can do to prevent environmental disaster, and the wealthy are certainly not the only ones who need to make changes. But let’s not forget that billionaires have a disproportionate amount of wealth and power, and they use this power to influence government policy and corporate practices in ways that benefit themselves at the expense of the rest of society.
For example, billionaires have been major beneficiaries of tax cuts that have shifted the tax burden onto the middle class and the poor. They have also used their money to lobby for policies that weaken environmental regulations and promote climate change denial. And they have used their control over corporations to exploit workers, drive down wages, and ship jobs overseas.
. They are actively shaping the system in ways that benefit them at the expense of everyone else. And this is why it is so important to hold them accountable. Sure, we can all make changes to reduce our environmental impact.
But these changes will have a much greater impact if they are made by the wealthy. For example, if billionaires stopped taking private jets, this would have a much greater impact on reducing greenhouse gas emissions than if the average person gave up eating meat.
So, to answer your question, I it’s a global responsibility and everyone including the billionaires living their lives above us all must start acting to help humanity as a whole. We need to make changes that we can control, and we also need to hold billionaires accountable for their actions. Only by doing both can we hope to make a real difference in the fight against climate change and other environmental problems.
But let’s not kid ourselves. The wealthy are not going to give up their power and privilege without a fight. They will use their money and influence to try to derail any efforts to hold them accountable. That’s why it is so important to build a mass movement of people who are willing to stand up to the billionaires and demand that they be held accountable for their actions.
The rich are certainly not the only ones who need to make change, but you can’t ignore that they must be held accountable for the damage they do to the world. They have a disproportionate amount of money and power, and they use this power to bend society and governments into their image.
Stop passing the blame, this isn’t a hot potato game when you pass the blame around and nobody actually does anything. Everyone must do their part
Yes let’s shift the blame off massive polluting companies, we should eat veggies and let them warm the earth
One of the things those massively polluting companies are doing to cause so much environmental harm is rearing meat…
Turning to veggies would cool the planet. That’s the point.
Exxon knew about climate change since 1971. They continue to make the problem worse to this day. Do you really think if people stop eating meat Exxon is suddenly going to do the right thing and fire everyone? Corporations are going to continue fucking over the environment for their own profit and energy companies (like Exxon) contribute much more CO2 and pollution than eating meat. These rich mult-national corporations are putting out articles to try to get people to place the burden on themselves to distract from their own wrongdoing.
Not in the slightest; I completely agree. Climate change cannot be solved by asking individuals to change their diets or make any other different individual decision. We have one option: revolution. The logic of infinite growth offers no way out of a problem caused by that same logic.
Luckily, revolution, the real movement to abolish the present state of things, is already underway. The start of the tipping point could be exactly one month from today, when BRICS+ plans a radical shift away from the dollar on 22 August.
The question for westerners, as unipolarity falls apart, is what measures they are willing to organise to implement when the opportunity to tackle climate change presents itself. A dietary change is one piece of the puzzle.
Brics are too incompetent to accomplish de-dollarization (or much of anything else). Lately Russia has only been making the dollar stronger. Nice fantasy though.
Time will tell.
Edit: This report shares your dismissal of BRICS (well, of any competition), but contradictorily warns of a decline of the dollar’s share.
But this report suggests that BRICS poses a real threat to the dollar.
Keep ignoring the FOREX charts and move to a BRICs country if you’re so confident they will succeed. Surely nothing could go wrong!
That’s a very strange thing to say. [Edit: especially considering that we started off with me clarifying that I completely agree with you about the contribution of corporations. Unless you’re just being contrarian.]
Remember the context of all this is what people everywhere need to do to save the plan[e]t and human society. I’m not gleeful that the end of dollar hegemony will plunge the west into recession and devastate living standards.
I’m just stating that it’s happening. Either climate change destroys life as we know it or the planet transitions to a sustainable political economy—currently, BRICS is making moves to bring that possiblity a step closer.
But I’m not necessarily a third worldist; I’m not saying that actions taken in the third world will automatically usher in a new world order. I’m saying it’s one (albeit significant) aspect in the real movement to abolish the present state of things, i.e. the definition of revolution.
So would eating chicken instead of beef, and you’ll get a whole lot more people to agree to that
That could be an improvement, but it’s not without environmental/emissions problems: https://doi.org/10.1016/j.scitotenv.2022.160014
Good info (remove the dot at the end to fix the link)
This type of rhetoric is just relieving big industries of their sole responsibility and enabling them. “It’s not my fault that I’m producing it, it’s your fault that you’re buying it” my ass. I won’t do a single shit unless the people that are actually causing this crisis do something.
In situations where the harm is caused by the industry’s approach, I’d agree. But animal products’ harm is pretty inextricable, and its production is caused by consumer demand.
But, the harm IS caused by the industry’s approach. People will always demand high caloric and tasty food, there is a way to respond to that ethically and environmentally friendly, and there is shoving thousands of cows in a tiny building, pumping antibiotics and whatever they are doing for the sake of pure profit
There are high caloric tasty vegan foods available, and when they are not it’s usually because they aren’t in high demand. How is the onus not on the consumer for picking animal products over those?
I’m all for vilifying the Animal Agriculture industry, they do some terrible stuff that goes way beyond the harm intrinsic to factory farms. But how exactly would they meet demand without factory farming, a brutally efficient way of producing animal products?
Governments should cease subsidizing animal products (maybe help their producers transition to other production), subsidize other foods more, and enact many other policy changes besides. But in most places it can be cheap and delicious to be vegan now. I don’t see how you get around personal choice being the main driver.
Ive got a question, would you be cheering if the meat industry took you up on your offer and immediately ceased all production? Or if oil companies stopped providing gasoline? The shipping industry comes to a standstill to avoid exhaust emissions, no more metal mining, natural gas plants are shut down. Does that go well for you?
