The FAA sent alerts to airlines after the Horizon Air incident saying “a validated jump seat passenger attempted to disable aircraft engines while at cruise altitude by deploying the engine fire suppressions system.”This is what I was looking for. From the title it seems like he just tried to throttle down but he was looking to incapacitate the engines. If he was successful it would have meant the airplane would have been in a glide without power. It seems likely as a pilot he’d know when to do this in a flight too to remove good chances of a safe landing. Truly terrifying!
Great, now jump seats are fucken ruined
I’m not so sure about that. The only thing more important that security to airline companies is “money”. Having to charter flights or wait for availability of their own flights to move staff around would be CRAZY expensive. I have full faith that airlines will look the other way on this one to avoid that cost to the companies.
Maybe they’ll just start putting them in cabin seats like the rest of us.
They already do that. However, if all the passenger seats are full (which isn’t uncommon) there is usually at least 1 but sometimes multiple jump seats on aircraft that allow airlines to move around pilots and other crew members to different airports. Airlines usually let other airlines fly their competitors staff because they also reciprocate when they need it.
Restricting the crew seats to just unsold passenger seats will likely have a huge impact to operations and ALL the different airlines’ bottom lines.
I doubt it. Aviation would grind to a halt is pilots and flight attendants can’t commute in jump seats. Besides, this guy was a captain. He could have done the same thing as a pilot, much like the Germanwings flight several years ago.
I’d think that in the majority of emergency situations, having an extra person who knows what’s going on in the cockpit would be more of a benefit than a risk. Especially given that one of the actual fight crew could decide to go all murder suicide on their flight, and unless the odds of any pilot doing this is greater than 50%, the more people in the cockpit, the more people to fight the bad ones off and take control of the plane and monitor things that would need monitoring in the event that someone successfully disables the engines.
Majority, probably not. Most emergency checklists are going to assume the cockpit crew is the normal count and throwing an extra person is is going to cause more harm than good. The only exception I can think of is UA Flight 232 which while tragic probably would have been worse without someone else in the cockpit.
Well, he’s fucked. 83 counts of attempted murder will send him into the Stratosphere of jail time. He’s gonna wish he just ate a bullet and fucked off by himself.
Narcissistic AND too much of a pussy to suck a shotgun. Great combo.
If we gave people who don’t want to be here anymore access to safe, effective, painless, suicide, desperate people wouldn’t have to resort to desperate methods of opportunity that can harm others.
We aren’t willing to be a society. We could not be more clear on that point. Visit one of your local tent cities where we leave defective capital batteries to die of exposure and police harassment if you’re still hazy on this fact. We aren’t willing to help the struggling in anything but empty rhetoric about how, lol, compassionate we consider ourselves. The least we could do is offer an out that doesn’t cause a scene or externalized death. Hell, turn it into an industry let our capitalist owners profit more off of it, win/win.
Inb4 “this bastard tried to kill others, they deserve no mercy!” yeah, when you’re suicidal, you aren’t exactly able to think outside your own pain, even more reason not to continue to let death by gun purchase be the current gold standard of American suicide.
While I agree that most of the talk about helping those struggling is empty I think it’s a bit disingenuous to imply suicide by airplane was the only option available to him. This happened in America were there are almost as many guns as people. Hurting others during a suicide attempt by trying to crash a plane is a choice.
We definitely need better mental health resources but killing 83 other people wasn’t his only option.
As stated, when you’re suicidal, you aren’t really looking beyond your own pain and opportunities to end it. It’s easy for someone who is doing all right to tell someone in white hot anguish what they should have done.
Your response is indemic of the crisis of empathy in this country. It’s easy for a rich person to tell a poor person what they should have done instead of stealing. Our people much prefer the easy way of casting judgment and advocating maximum punitive vengeance so that they can play pretend we live in a black and white, just nation and world, where everyone earned what they have and the suffering did something to deserve it.
The hard thing would trying to understand for what drove one of our people to this madness to begin with, and maybe even help. But that would be extremely un-American. Hoo boy, lets deep fry his ass boy howdy! Gonna get assed raped in prison itellyouwhat that’ll teach him to… value the sanctity of the lives of himself and others?
If he’s not thinking clearly, why he would he choose your proposed suicide method? It’s a more rational choice but like you’ve said this isn’t a decision being made rationally.
The same reason that people like him choose methods that can fail by being inturrupted, by failure of method, or by possibility of permanent disability/disfigurement rather than death.
Certainty.
The offer of going to an office with a guarantee of an end would stop the vast majority of other methods where one must overcome that lack of certainty to make the attempt. Even a gunshot to the head can and does fail, leaving matters significantly worse for the individual.
I’m not saying it would stop everyone, but it would stop a great many of desperate people from buying guns or running into traffic while in a bad place and potentially using it on someone they feel is the cause before themselves, or situations like this.
Some people want to go out loud, but that isn’t the norm. The goal is usually just going out with a minimum of suffering, with the loudness of the act being a symptom of the person’s opportunities for attempts, ie what they can and cannot access.
Maybe you are the one lacking empathy here if you think that it is right and defendable for someone to eradicate 83 lives because they are depressed.
Please learn to read
I don’t want to agree with you, but I do.
I chose staring down ugly truths over the bliss of ignorance a long time ago. It’s my core value, and I understand why most don’t, it isn’t a pleasant way to think or live.
What a shitty take. No amount of suicidal thoughts or emotional disturbance he had could’ve justified the murder of 83 innocent people, all with their own lives, loved ones, experiences… You are trying to justify their eradication by saying that it’s excusable to kill people if you are depressed.
Your lit teacher had a lot of discussions with your parents, eh?
Not even a single word above you is a justification, any more than advocating for fire safety regulations is justifying wildfires.
You wanna try reading it again? Take it slow, sound out the words?
Has anyone said anything about a motive yet? I haven’t seen anyone say why they think he tried to do it.
I’d say depression, suicidal ideation, possibly just wanted to end it all. Or maybe they sat him between literally every baby on the flight.
Unless I am misremembering, they had what they thought was a pretty firm link between the suicide-by-piloting crash in Europe and a pilot’s relationship/divorce.
I mean, “intentional pilot crashing” is probably not in the top ten list of causes of air fatalities, but I wonder if they should have an additional level of screening because of the possibility of job stresses and responsibilities clashing with the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune.
Probably a Trump supporter and there was a brown person on board.
I’m speculating he was doing it for the lolz. I have no source. Some people are just dicks and do dickish things for fun. If he wanted to die, he could do it when he was piloting his own plane.
Can you imagine if he successfully stopped the engines and the pilots safely glided to a landing?
Okay, I imagined it. What next?
Now, rotate a cow in your mind.
Assume a perfectly spherical cow.
Can it be in a vacuum?
Rotating is too much work. It’ll be right side up in the end anyway so I didn’t do it. Now what?
Cool right? Those pilots are heroes.
They’d have had a fight on their hands probably. FedEx 705 all over again:
I’m pretty sure all commercial airplanes have to be able to do this. And I’m even more sure that a gliding landing is part of their aircraft certification training
All aircraft can glide, of course. They also have a ram air turbine to power control surfaces even with engine or APU power. And it has been done before such as Air Canada Flight 143 (the famous Gimli Glider), and Air Transat Flight 236 (the Azores glider)
But you can generally at best go 12 times your altitude, so even at cruise altitude, you need somewhere within 60 miles or so to put down. It certainly would have been far harder to put down unpowered.
In a second notification, the FAA clarified that the security event is not connected to current world events.
I’m curious about how they determined this.
